#and mineru was the one to introduce that at all

[soul-of-the-hero]

Ngl…highly disappointed mineru’s mech wasn’t a fuckin mecha dragon you pilot by holding on to the horns can you imagine

[alphascorpiixx]

I’ve gotten most of the way through totk (i think) and I’m pretty sure at this point the sages are never going to get names/face reveals

like before the game’s release I didn’t want the champions to return because they died a hundred years ago and their spirits are at peace now they don’t need to be brought back for some plot contrivance

but in comparison the sages preform the same narrative role (warriors from the past who fought ganon and are now passing on their powers to help the future generation suceed this time) yet they’re such a downgrade to the champions. Like at this point I’d rather have beloved established characters return then have them replaced with lackluster characters who don’t even have names

[hollysoda]

Okay so I know that totk turned one year old a couple of days ago but I was away for the weekend and didn’t get a chance to post something about it. Now I’m home again, I think I wanna just put some thoughts down

Firstly, I still love totk. It was a really fun game and had just as much fun playing through it complete blind as I did playing botw with only a loose knowledge of the game. In fact, I enjoyed it more than botw. Maybe it was because I knew more about Zelda than what I did back in September 2022 when I first played botw, or maybe it was because I could see the improvements they made when it came to dungeons and overall exploration. For at least six months totk was my favourite zelda game. Now, a year on, it isn’t.

I think on reflection totk is a very flawed game. While it is technically genius, story-wise it’s incredibly weak, possibly the weakest in the entire franchise. Here are a few points worth mentioning:

Why bother bringing back Ganondorf if he isn’t going to have any real motive? Is there a reason why he’s fighting with Rauru and seeking his own secret stone, or is he just doing it for funsies? Part of the reason why Wind Waker Ganondorf is so good is because he has a strong and clear motive. Without any motive, totk Ganondorf just feels like an enemy rather than a main antagonist

The main thing that drives forward a story is a theme to take away from it. Breath of the Wild’s theme was exploration and lost memories, Skyward Sword’s theme was loyalty and/or devotion, but it’s hard to tell what totk’s theme is. Sacrifice could be the outstanding one, seeing as both Zelda and Rauru make crucial sacrifices for the sake of Hyrule, but where else is it seen in the story? Totk just tries too many things, and having a clear theme would just help to solidify things

For a game that was supposed to solve the mystery of who the Zonai were it sure did a poor job at doing so. I absolutely adore the Zonai and in my opinion Rauru and Mineru’s designs as some of the coolest in the entire franchise but my god. Their lore is so underdeveloped it hurts. We know the bare minimum about their civilisation and culture. We still don’t know why they died off, why they built the labyrinths (and by extension who the Lord of dragons/owls/boars are), why they have secret stones in the first place, why is the Temple of Time in the sky when it was originally on the ground and most importantly why is draconification a forbidden act. If you’re gonna imply that the three dragons introduced in botw were once people then tell us!! Totk deserved a dlc that could explain all of this and not leave us in the unknown

Saying that the Sheikah technology just “disappeared” is an absolutely awful way of saying “uh yeah we never thought about that”. That’s some god awful world-building and planning on the developers behalf. Even if they just said that after the Calamity it lost its magic and then parts of it were repurposed for new technology, like the Skyview towers, it would be so much more believable. The Divine Beasts should have at least been in the game somewhere, perhaps in the depths. The lack of Sheikah tech makes the game feel so disjointed from botw, and makes totk feel as though it’s only a sequel because it has the same characters in it

The ending of the game just doesn’t sit right with me. Why bother having Mineru beg Zelda not to swallow her secret stone if in the end she would be able to turn back into a human. I understand the developers want a happy ending but at least let there be consequences. Let Zelda’s memory be a bit hazy or give her dragon features like many artists have done and let Link permanently be an amputee

Also the Ancient Hero angers me. I’ve got no problems with him not being a hylian because honestly it makes it wayy more interesting knowing that not every hero was hylian, but just explain why. If he’s some sort of Zonai, why doesn’t he look like Rauru and Mineru? Is he some sort of hybrid or a different breed of Zonai? And why does the tapestry depict him as a hylian if he’s not? Seems like an oversight more than anything

I think I should stop there because this post is getting long but uh TL;DR totk could have been a phenomenal game if they spent more time planning out the storyline and fleshing out lore. I get it, the game was originally botw dlc, but after so many delays we at least deserved a better story.

I do still love this game though Tears of the Dragon goes HARD

[thecluelessdoctor]

It's rambling time

*CRAWLS OUTTA WELL WITH A COMEDICALLY LARGE BACKPACK FULL OF NOTES*

I love totk. Don't get me wrong. I love it. But HOLY HELL TO I WANNA STRANGLE WHO EVER THOUGHT 'HEY MAN LETS GET RID OF ALL THE SHEIKAH TECH OTHER THAN LIKE- TWO GUARDIANS' LIKE EXSQUEEZE ME?? MY BABIESSSS/HJ

But on a serious note, I hate the fact how not only Zelda's character development go backwards, it forced a very black and white view on Hyrule. Rauru and kingdom of Hyrule good, Ganondorf bad. Like. What??? EXSQUEEZE ME.

Okz sure, Ganondorf did murder Sonia and steal a secret stone, and attack Hyrule, but like. Let's just- also note this. If the gerudo have a similar story to the sheikah, the kingdom of Hyrule, aka Rauru forced their hand into surrender.

Though I do like the 'keep your loved ones close and your enemies closer' trope (waiting for the ship art/j)

Let me note here, I am rather young, and Botw is what introduced me into LOZ. So. I still have a lot to learn. Anyway! On ward! (Also warning spoilers for TOTK jsndhdbdbdbd)

*sits down on a grassy patch, unpacking bag*

So!! Oh brother where to I start. Let's start with Zelda first because oh my hylia does it hurt.

Ok.

So, Zelda finds out about Zonai and the thing under Hyrule castle, it's understandable that she would be curious! It was established that she was a curious person.

Anyway, she gets yeeted into the past with a TIME power?!? WHAT. I mean it would explain why it took so long for her light power to wake the fuck up, but still?? It feels so random and forced.

Also in BOTW she spends one HUNDRED years keeping a calamity from destroying hyrule, and now suddenly she can't do jack in TOTK?!? EXSQUEEZE ME. WHAT. SHE MAKES A DAGGER GO BACK IN TIME. wOw- link mastered the power in a day- (I'm sorry but I have so many link rambles)

I just MY BRAIN HURTS. also I just- what the fuck happened to the sheikah?!

Yeah we are talking about this now. Like- fuckers are forgotten by EVERYONE- what happened to the shrines?! OR THE GIANT ASS DIVINE BEASTS LIKE WHERE ARE YOU RUDANA- *SOBS* Oh yeah and let's not forget the fact the champions have been forgotten basically. And Sidon moved the statue of his dead sister to make a statue of link riding him. Don't take that out of context. Also how the fuck did they get rid of the lynel up the mountain like?! Even if link killed it for them it would come back every time- endless building there made it so it couldn't come back there-??? Didn't know monsters had manners. I just- UGH.

Ah yes back to the sheikah tech. Everyone, even the sheikah have forgotten it like bruh. Even if it was like- 8 years since BOTW still- they couldn't have suddenly found everything and got rid of the shrines???

Like- the yiga clan (yes fucks I am talking about them) the yiga clan giving up learning about the sheikah for the Zonai makes sense- because the yiga clan has the depth now- and, they didn't have as much *known* access to sheikah tech. But like- PURAH FOR EXAMPLE- WHY WOULD SHE FORGET ABOUT THE TECH SKDNDJHR- IDC HOW HOT YOU ARE IM MAD AT YOU FOR THAT!

Oh and *SIGHS* lemme talk about the sages. No no, not the ones WE know now, I mean the ones of past. I hate them. The only one I like is the one of the gorons because of that one line he says

Me too buddy, me too/j

Anyway.

I wanna fucking murder these sages. Do they all share the same brain cell??? Other than you Mineru I like you.

Wait hold on that's meme potential. SOMEONE DRAW THE SAGES HAVING THE SAME BRAINCELL/HJ

But I just

I hate them.

So much.

Now let me talk about the best characters in TOTK. Besides kogha.

Farosh, Dinraal, and Naydra.

Dear golly I love these dragons. I vibe with them.

Now it's time for my personal favorite topic

THE YIGA CLAN

I love them. And. Yeah

Though I'm very sad about the missed potential for them. Also is it just me or is almost every yiga a dude..

Idk what to say. Just. I love them. And. Kogha better come back or I will cry/J he always comes back-(I'm sorry)

And the last topic of the evening

Link.

I have

Thoughts

Uhm

Ok less about link I love him but like the fact he's so chill about the fact he doesn't have a arm and now has the arm of a furry might say smt.

But at least in BOTW impa is like 'hey you sure your ready to take on what's next and save hyrule' but now it's like 'fucker go do this this and this and go look at the funny ass paintings on the ground' like. Damn ok. ;-;

I can't tell you how much I stalled playing totk. I had such a hard time finishing regional phenomenon. It just- wasn't fun. I knew what to expect, and what was going to happen. So. Yeah.

But I did really like Rito Village. And gorons town. They basically got addicted to drugs and I am ALL FOR IT (not drugs. Don't do drugs) but the Zora's felt... Boring. I mean they felt boring in botw but it got worse. Personally I thought the gerudo were the most boring in botw which is saying something because I got to sneak through the yiga hide out and Rob Kogha. But the zora felt- basic like. Yeah. At least everything else caused you damage or made things harder- the shroud made navigation hard, snow caused damage, the meat roast made conversion harder

But the zora? The sludge just- made you slower??? Idk man.

And omg. Do Sidon and yona make me mad. YEAH, HATE ME FOR IT SIDON FANS!! like people hate yona bc she's engaged to sidon. Personally I dislike them both. Like- Sidon lost the spark that made him- him! And yona- yona is just annoying. Like fuck off mipha copy.

And oh my hylia the MUCKDROCK- I hate it. No. No I loath it. Like what the fuck are you your fucking shrimp.

And it's fight wasn't even that hard. It was just annoying. Like- colagara in my opinion was the easiest, but it was super fun. But the muchdrock? He sucked.

Also btw- before the wrap up, has anyone found the smoldering coliseum and got zants helm??? Just me? Ok :') apparently it's the ice verison of the thunder helm. Now I think there is a fire one.. hmMmmm

Anyway! That wraps up the ramble!

[toushindai]

speaking as someone who's repeatedly described herself as "just a girl trying to be an encyclopedia," I really wish we got more of Mineru

(headcanon/character analysis below)

My headcanon for the Zonai is that they just kind of. declined. Something about life in the sky made there be less and less of them until they dwindled to an unsustainable population level. This may be related to how much zonaite they can access--the idea of zonaite being scarce in the sky is introduced really early on[1]. And in terms of "the Zonai and scarcity" I also want to point at the description for the hydrant device, which says that the Zonai were experiencing water shortages until they invented the hydrant, which is an absolutely batshit thing to say, by the way. But anyway: scarcity. Something unsustainable about the way they lived. That's the general vibe for me.

So we have just Mineru and Rauru, now, and I think that that solitude sat differently on each of them. I think it drove Rauru to the surface, out of curiosity but also out of this horror of loneliness. We feel that loneliness when we explore the sky islands: that beautiful, lowing horn music--the cries of the birds--the gold during sunset that eats into your eyes and makes it hard to believe that you exist. A beauty that doesn't need you there. I think Rauru needed to escape that.

Mineru, I think, didn't feel that loneliness in the same way because upon realizing how little was left she buried herself in learning everything she could about the Zonai. This is after all (most likely) the first thing we learn about her: that she knows the most about the Zonai out of anyone. We know also from the tablets in the sky that she would often bury herself in her studies to the extent that she would forget to eat or sleep. And, we know the nature of her research: building a construct that would house her spirit after her body passed. There is not a doubt in my mind that she intended to make herself into the last of the Zonai, everlasting. A preserving tomb for her heritage. When she saw that she and Rauru were the last ones left--all that there would ever be--she put aside any desire to be her own person and instead intended to contain all her people's knowledge and legacy in her spirit and in the construct she crafted for it.

(But to some extent, this necessitated holding on to her sense of self. I already had this impression from thinking about the English, but the no-subject-needed nature of Japanese sentences made it even more certain in my mind: Mineru considered draconification for herself but decided that the ego death it entailed did not serve her purposes. This is why she knows of it; this is why her more heartfelt argument against it is not merely its forbidden nature but the loss of self that comes with it. What was it like, then, to see Zelda elect this course of action that Mineru had set aside for quite literally selfish reasons?)

I've seen meta before that suspects Mineru was subject to parentification, to the need to be both sister and parent to Rauru--I think that is very likely--my opinion differs from the analysis I've seen in that I do not think that was a role she fulfilled with much warmth or attention. She does not strike me as someone with much capacity for that to begin with, and once she set herself on the frankly dehumanizing path of carrying on her people's legacy I think warmth becomes a distantly tertiary concern. She has already ceased to wholly think of herself as a person, in service to the preservation of her people; she forgets or foregoes her own physical needs; it takes a mental shift, then, to ground herself enough to be present for Rauru. I would be surprised if it occurred to her to do this anywhere near as often as Rauru needed it.

I think Rauru and Sonia coaxing her down to the surface probably helped with all of this detachment a little, but not much. She really does not seem to me like a very present person. I think that if she saw Rauru's own attempts to preserve Zonai culture (teaching the Hylians to use Zonai technology, creating the shrines to encourage Zonai-style thought), it did not supersede or lessen the urgency of her own mission.

I think about the construct and her spirit--and Rauru's shrines for that matter--being converted from their original purpose of maintaining Zonai presence and legacy in Hyrule to being locked away for millennia in order to empower the hero of the future; I think about Mineru's spirit finally passing at the end of the game, Link's arm returned to his natural one instead of Rauru's, the Zonai finally and truly laid to rest. This letting go of trying to preserve one's culture forever, is it a relief or a tragedy or both?

Also I think she suffers from chronic pain and limited mobility, that's just the vibe I get from her, and that makes another reason for her to be interested in housing her spirit in a construct beyond the limits of her body, yes I know the one tablet says she dances, how nice it is that she has some low-pain days but some days I think moving is very hard and tiring for her. My mind will not be changed.

---

[1] though we should note, we are told this in a zonaite-mining cave on the Great Sky Island, which was not only not originally in the sky, it was not originally in the depths, now was it? introducing at least one location where zonaite could once be found on the surface

[shannonsketches]

(Same anon from earlier) I meant like in totk especially it’s like he just comes out of nowhere and is just being a butt for no reason but now that I’ve though about it, yeah I’d be pretty mad if space furries just tried to claim the land too. Just wish we would’ve seen that motive, you know? Nothing against the game tho, I looooove it!

Hello Same Anon From Earlier! I also love it. I have a LOT of beef with the gameplay / mechanics priorities but I do love it lol

But I actually disagree with this, I feel like TotK gave us the most concrete on-screen context of why he did what he did!

Like, OoT is my baby, but the older games are much shorter, and much less focused on Ganondorf himself, so the in-game framing he's just introduced with the two traits of Power Hungry and Being a Dick to Children. Wind Waker was much more sympathetic, but his reason was 'I wanted their land because mine sucked', TP was 'I got executed before I could do this last time lol'

There are a lot of very subtle storytelling reasons in the context of the games, but all of them point to Ganondorf being the one who started shit with Hyrule for his own gain. Despite TotK's best efforts, it actually told us the opposite was true:

Even just between the Molduga and Fealty scenes, we explicitly learn

Rauru was pushing into Gerudo Territory (Molduga can only swim in soft sand, and couldn't be a threat to any establishment outside the desert)

Rauru repeatedly invited the Gerudo to 'be accepted into the protective embrace' of Hyrule and 'serve it faithfully' which is a wild thing to say to a sovereign nation whose only known threat is you

Rauru calls accepting his own invitation a ' welcome appeal,' which is also wild, and says it's reassuring that someone as baller as Ganondorf would make such an appeal.

Rauru acknowledged Ganondorf as a known Gerudo hero in front of his people, and told Zelda he's aware of his 'evil nature' which. Is he a hero or is he evil, R? Are his people evil too? (yes, actually, he and Hyrule do in fact consider anyone who agrees with Ganondorf evil lol) which.... their exchange may or may not imply Ganondorf killed a lot of Zonai during the war imo lmao

Further dialogue tells us explicitly that Rauru never wanted Ganondorf as an ally, he only ever wanted him under his personal surveillance (and was actively badgering him about it!!)

Then, when Ganondorf takes the stone, he says Rauru took it for granted and squandered it, and that Sonia is a victim of his arrogance -- which, depending on how you read Ganondorf, could either mean he could've squashed his enemies or solved bigger issues for his country (he most likely meant both, if other game context is applied).

And, in Mineru's retelling of the story, she literally says the Zonai came down from their land and Rauru 'used zonai knowledge to become a great leader', met a Hylian woman, gave her immense power, and together they decided to establish a kingdom. And we know from prior scenes, that their kingdom -- according to Ganondorf -- repeatedly pressured the other kingdoms to unite under Rauru's rule (and then showing us that there are massive deposits beneath those countries of an ore on which only one of those eight societies runs, and it just so happens to be the one who is demanding to be in charge of the others, despite only having two members of its society left -- and we know it happened after Gan's fealty show because there are Gerudo Heroine statues pointing to the mine, despite the Gerudo not having any need for Zonaite).

I am with you and I also wish we would see more from Ganondorf's perspective -- because he is an established hero to his people, and has been noted as such in two games now separately from his status as king (with the framing of course being that his followers, too, are Evil -- which both games proved to be a Hylian assumption that Link is able to experience differently). It would be really cool to continue the tradition of Link getting to see another side of things by letting Zelda interact with him on her own, since she most likely would've been allowed into Gerudo Town. Even if it was just an attempt to spy for Rauru, Zelda is a compassionate character, and letting her meet him and see how he is with his people would've been really cool, and probably would've offered her perspective that she would never have otherwise.

But while Nintendo's never going to do an explicitly anti-imperialism story, and I don't love Aonuma's black-and-white taste in narrative design, I do credit him with knowing everyone has different taste indeed, and this really sticks out to me from his interview in which he is discussing interpretation potential of TotK:

ALL that said, and please forgive me for rambling, IMO we saw Ganondorf's motive much more clearly than we have in prior games. Even if it isn't explicitly stated as 'this is why I did that btw' (because that would disrupt the Defeat the Evil narrative), the circumstances that are explicitly stated leading up to his decision are much more pointed than they have made room for in the past.

Personally I'm just glad they let Ganondorf be a human being with personal, logical, politically relevant reasons again and not just 'this man isn't really a man he's a literal actual demon in human shape and because he is evil incarnate his only purpose is to destroy our good and holy kingdom blessed by the one true goddess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ '

According to yesterday, it's been exactly Seventeen Years since that's happened. :')

[thegeminisage]

long ass post major spoilers tldr i beat it

ok, i've got an hour, time to get started on the end of this game 😤

first straight to lookout landing to introduce purah and mineru.......

or no wait since im here and havent done it in awhile ill swing by the great fairy. if theres any armor i can possibly upgrade i really need to do that lol

okay there isn't really. lol. after pikmin 4 i am gonna need to farm so many materials......

okay, i cooked some food but i dont actually have anything useful so most of it is just atk up/def up/health refills. only a few anti-gloom foods, which is sure to get my ass kicked...

now i guess i just........dive in...................................

im nervous.

i dont have a lot of weapons and bows rn either but whatever ig!!! surely nintendo will provide. i have the master sword fused with one of the light dragon parts so she can fight with me in every possible way!!! also i think the durability wont be affected when it's in its glow mode which it will be down there

thunderstorm as i walk up to the castle lol. classic

alright. WELL. geronimo.

wow that really is. a long way down. okay.

okay hold on wait there's a spot missing on my map. do i get a fucking lightroot down here? i just check. it is so high up. probably unclimbable. do i need to dive again? i'm diving again. fast traveling to the shrine above this time

the bg ambience down here is fucking freaky btw

ok, i got it this time. whew.

back down i go. yeesh.

my neighbors pick NOW to mow their lawn. fuck me sideways

oh im already one heart lost. this floor is COVERED in gloom...

THE FIGHT MUSIC THO...damn

ugh, four hearts down and only two recovery items...yikes. i'm gonna get my ass beat fr but i don't have time to go farm sundelions nor do i want to rn

i can't figure out where to go. i went down a hole with monsters bc that seemed like the only route but now i can't find a way to proceed

did my sword just RING at me??????

fi girl what is going on

oh fuck me there's a gloom lynel

okay yeah no. this isn't gonna work. i need to fucking go farm fucking sundelions. UGH im so mad about it

okay. farmed. going to cook. jesus fuck

COOKED. warping back to the lightroot. bet that mf lynel refilled its stupid health

it did.

I GOT HIM.......ohhh it broke my sword to do it :( i didnt know it could break when it was powered up like that. but i got him...

but now where do i...?

this doesn't feel right. i feel like i'm just heading back into the depths. probably fought that lynel for no reason at all. but i'm scared to look up a walkthru bc of spoilers :(

ok, i did find a guide and i think this is the right way? im scrolling down like one line at a time lol

THE POWER OF A SAGE CANNOT REACH YOU??? OH THIS IS DEFINITELY THE RIGHT WAY

it was way too crowded with all of them but now i feel verrry alone

I FOUND HANDS................

ohhhh i do not want to fight phantom ganon in this gloom covered arena. i do not want to

but with no sages...i can't get across without engaging...

OKAY. THE GOOD NEWS. KILLED THE HANDS. THE BAD NEWS. PHANTOM GANON CHASED ME UP TO THIS HIGH SPOT

GOT HIS ASS!!!! gibdo bone arrows you motherFUCKER

ok, i got across the room...

wait. this looks familiar

THE MUSIC!!!! THIS IS IT THIS IS WHERE I STARTED..................

GLOOM REDEADS!!!!! not today motherfuckers. im not getting jumped im NOT getting jumped

the murals...i can blow up the rocks now

OH MY GODDD.....

the imprisoning war, zelda healing the sword, and becoming a dragon...she WALKED RIGHT PAST THESE with her ALREADY HAVING DONE IT in the past, not knowing she was about to do it again in her own future...oh my god im gonna be SICK

oh that is a big hole.

WAIT...THIS IS THE HOLE SHE FELL DOWN........

WHY IS THE MUSIC DOING THIS...im scared someone come hold my hand

oh my god. the torch zelda dropped is at the bottom of this hole.

im picking it up and im fucking giving it back to her

it JUST keeps going down....

oh god another big jump. OKAAAYYYYY

what IS that..............

DEMON ARMY??? BY MYSELF?????

OH MY GODDDDDDD MY BESTIES!!!! THE GANG IS HERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! fuck me im welling up. ive never been more glad for a crowded screen

got my master sword back. fused with zelda's horn. refilled my health. THIS IS ITTTTTT

ROUND TWO!!!!!! IM NOT AFRAID OF ANYTHINGGGG

round three is redeads. i am afraid of some things actually

im not getting jumped. i am NOT getting jumped. ive been playing this game for 200 hours and they havent got close enough to jump me yet i AM NOT GETTING JUMPED.

oh my god this music is AMAZINGGGG

AND I DIDN'T GET JUMPED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ROUND FOUR!!!!! bring it bring it bring it

BOSS RUSH?

oh my god no...NOOOO my besties.........

i'm alone again :( and with seven minutes until my sword recharges...

ah. i can't save here

oh my god THERE HE IS!!!!!!

the music...

dehydrated voice is so much better

OHHHH MY GOD HE DRANK SOME WATER.....THIS IS FROM THE TRAILERS........

does he have black nail polish on his fingers AND TOES? get it girl

THEY REVIVIED MY MASTER SWORD.......

zelda's with me 😭😭😭 this one's for you babygirl

this music is so quiet and sinister wtf...........

is he. IS HE FLURRY RUSHING ME??

THAT'S MY TRICK, YOU CAN'T DO THAT.........

phase one DOWN. eat gibdo bone my guy

DEMISE FORM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

IM ABSOLUTELY WAILING THEYRE PLAYING THE OOT GANONDORF MUSIC LIKE IM GENUINELY WELLING UP

HIS HEALTH BAR?????????????????????????????????????????

TULIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! right as the botw theme plays omg

YUNOBOOOOOO

SIDON AND RIJU.........ONE MORE

AND MINERU!!!! there she IS!!!!! six on one babey

HALFWAY THERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! cutscene reward

no no no not my besties again

DID HE JUST BREAK MY HEARTS FR???

ohhh the calamity ganon theme!!!

hylian shield badly damaged. GREAT.

i can't get him with my sword. he always does that slowmo thing backwards. but i CAN get him with my lynel bow and gibdo arrows >:)

she died as she lived: running away from the bad guy and shooting at him over her shoulder

GOT HIS ASS!!!!!

OHHHH HE'S GONNA SWALLOW IT...........

i knew this was coming bc of spoilers but it's still incredible. that man just put his whole fist down his throat 😳

compare that to the dainty way zelda swallowed hers lol...

DID THIS MF JUST EAT ME???

wait...his dragon form...is just the calamity???

TIME?? LOOP??????????????

the tune from the trailers........

oh my god okay he's a normal dragon. i was about to start having heart palpitations

i just STRAIGHT UP. for real burst into tears. i have to pause

zelda came to help me................................you go 200 hours thinking she doesn't know or remember you but she RESCUED me she CAUGHT ME.........she's so little compared to him oh god.......

AM I CONTROLLING HER?? WE'RE FLYING TOGETHER...........

accidentally jumped off.

THE MUSIC. THE SAXOPHONE. I'D GIVEN UP ON EVER SEEING IT AGAIN THAT'S GOTTA BE MY MF BINGO

i'm literally crying too much to fight him rn

oh man landing on his back hurts me...how tf am i supposed to get him

one weak spot down. three to go. she literally catches me...literally there's saxophone...

two more! every time she catches me i start bawling again. this is so embarrassing like there are literally tears on my face as i play this. i didn't know she was gonna do that. i knew he turned into a dragon but i didn't know she was gonna help me

she is literally still in there after 10,000 years. her 100 in hyrule castle must feel like nothing in comparison

man and him in the ouroboros position every time...

BLOOD MOON????

RIGHT INTO HIS FOREHEAD JUST LIKE WIND WAKER

bro i am FUCKING sobbing

dark beast ganon theme.

HOLY SHIT...THE EXPLOSION....IS EVERYBODY OKAY??????

oh my god oh my GOD...THE PEOPLE WHO LOVE HER

ARE GONNA CHANGE HER BACK

his arm..............

I CAUGHT HER.......FINALLY.......CATHARSIS...................

IN HIS AAAAAARMS

OH GOD FI......

quest status find princess zelda: complete. i'm losing it. i found her. fucking found her.

she's HOME.

CREDITS ROLL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! im trying to collect myself during this time. when i say i am fucking sobbing i am not exaggerating. i am boohoo wailing with tears rolling down my fucking face. legend of zelda tears of ME because of this GAME!!!!!!!

i dont even care that they broke the lore. ok i do care a lot actually but whatever. whatever.

THE CREDITS ARE SO GOOD..........all the shots of link touching people's hands!!!!!!!!!!

AND THEIR HANDS FIXING ZELDA.....

AND CATCHING HERRRRRRRRR

the end...........

OH POST CREDITS CUTSCENE.......

mineru....there goes mom #4, twice

NOOOO IF SHE CRIES IM GONNA GET STARTED AGAIN

oh my god. that was amazing

this is my first time seeing the title screen. i haven't closed the game once since may 12

oh my god that was AMAZING. i am sitting here in total awe!!!!!!!

NOW i can finally enjoy zeldatube again.....i can hear all the theories........i can pirate this mf SOUNDTRACK HOLY SHIT. but first i gotta update my bingo board

wow. what a game

[mudkippey]

It's weird how Tears of the Kingdom leaves us with more questions than answers. I feel thematically it makes sense that Breath of the Wild would have a lot of mysteries, since for a lot of the game Link's past is a mystery. But ToTK? Even though it finally explained who the Zonai are, it left us with even more questions! (And it's kind of odd so much focus is on the Zonai, considering they were only mentioned by name in Making of a Champion as far as I know).

-What happened to the Zonai? Ganondorf mentions Rauru and Mineru are the only ones left, so where are the others? Did they die out? Go somewhere else? Why aren't we told? This feels like something that shouldn't be a mystery. Rauru knows, Ganondorf probably knows, Mineru knows, Zelda probably asked and thus knows, why do none of the memories mention this? Seeing how excited Zelda was in the opening over finding those murals, I feel her memories would contain more about her discovering this kind of stuff.

-Speaking of memories, the dragons. We know how they're made now, so what was their reasoning? This is probably setup for DLC. Or maybe it's just something for us to wonder about.

-The Zonai ruins from BoTW. Namely, they look DIFFERENT from the ones we see in ToTK. What's up with the ones we find in the Faron region? Were there a bunch of Zonai who really liked the jungle? But if Mineru and Rauru are the only Zonai left...what happened to them? The Typhlo ruins quest gives some answers, but Faron is still up in the air.

-The calamity 10,000 years ago. What's the deal with that hero? Where did the Sheikah get their technology? Did they use the Zonai's technological knowledge? Again, it's odd that something from BoTW is still so unexplored. Instead, we're introduced to an even older war. Which makes sense for introducing the source of the calamity (Ganondorf) but this big event is never explored. We're thrown a bone when it comes to the hero (I'm not going to spoil it but if you know you know) and honestly...that leaves even more questions. Maybe it's laying foundation for DLC?

-What's the deal with Gerudo politics during Ganondorf's reign? We see him leading them, but the lightning sage has allied with Rauru. Was this a one-off, or were a bunch of Gerudo allying with Rauru? Ganondorf is also referred to as a hero to his people so...what led her/them to do that? When we're told "the last free Gerudo village has fallen" once Ganondorf goes demon mode, does that mean last Gerudo settlement PERIOD or the last one not under his rule? This game lifted a lot from OoT, and in that game the Gerudo largely escaped his wrath (aside from Nabooru, because she defied him).

-What happens to the Sheikah technology from BoTW? Someone on YouTube (the pinnacle of credibility) said there was dialogue mentioning it was disassembled so it couldn't be compromised again but...why? As far as Hyrule knew, Ganon was dead. Why did the Sheikah, who were so curious about this technology, not keep the shrines and figure out how to use their teleportation ability? The Shrines were never compromised, why disassemble them? I get we need room for the new Zonai shrines but it's odd there's not a good explanation for the absence of all Sheikah technology.

I wish the overworld had more of those murals we saw at the start of the game. It would make re-exploring the overworld from BoTW more enjoyable I think. Let us stumble upon an ancient Sheikah lab where we see they were working with Zonai technology to make what we saw in BoTW. Give us more insight on the first calamity. Have old ruins in Gerudo desert that give insight on life under Ganondorf before he was utterly lost in the sauce, or show us what happened to his followers after he was. Have more Zonai murals that show what happened to them and give us more clues on the dragons.

Archeology and studying the past is definitely a Thing in ToTK, and using murals to find out more about the past is introduced in the beginning. Why not continue that trend and make it part of the overworld, let us analyze them and draw our own conclusions like Zelda did at the start!

[casiavium]

okay this and I was going to leave a comment but it got too long lol

as per usual totk spoilers, totk critism

For me the big difference between SwS adding Hylia to canon as a retcon that fucks with some earlier games and ToTK adding the Zonai is that the Zonai literally came out of nowhere. They weren't even important in BOTW. They had no design, and now they're introduced as an entirely new species that's already been wiped out by the time they become important? How are Mineru and Rauru the last of their kind and yet Rauru is the first king of Hyrule and most powerful ever (idk I haven't finished the game). There's this whole civilization that's apparently been above AND below Hyrule that has never even been hinted at, and while I love the depths (the sky.... not so much tbh), it definitely feels like it came out of nowhere.

Hylia, however, though she doesn't exist until SwS, makes sense. The Hylians are named after Hyrule which is named after a goddess of Hyrule (not a God capital G, which a lot of western players don't seem to get-- Hylia is not God and Demise is not Satan, she and Demise are more akin to Shinto gods, even in BOTW with all the shrines. In BOTW I see her as like the Roman Imperial Cult, where individual colonized and conquered nations like the Gerudo can still worship their Heroines and Sand Goddess as long as they add a place to venerate Hylia, the god of the land, who is NOT the king of the gods or highest god in the pantheon. Roma, the goddess and personification of "Rome", came after the city was built up. Hylia came after Hyrule because Hyrule needed to be established for her to be needed, but she was then co opted by the leaders to prove divine lineage and right to rule--this is all theory and observation moreso than actual canon btw, except Hylia as God capital G, because she isn't). Hylia is mentioned in maybe two other games? A Link to the Past and Twilight Princess refer to Hylians as "The people of Hylia", meaning the land of Hyrule, but it would make sense to personify Hyrule as a goddess.

The Zonai are cool, but.... they come out of nowhere, they don't build off of already existing lore, they retcon by changing the past through time travel and having the past and present in one game instead of creating an origin myth that explains, not totally changes. I see a lot of people say Hylia is a retcon, but really she's not. She's additional exposition, a prequel, an explanation that might be mistranslated through time but still fits. Anything that's speculation (why did Hylia make 7 year old OOT Link the hero) isn't a retcon, it's the creators not really caring about the implications of adding her in after so many games were already made because they are children's games made for children, they're meant to be fun and work on their own, they're not all dark like mm and totk (but also SHE'S DEAD they DID fix it BY MAKING HER NOT ALIVE TO MAKE THOSE CHOICES) . The Zonai, and Zelda's sealing powers coming from Rauru, not her Hylia bloodline, is a true retcon, as that is what is directly said in BOTW.

Zonai? you mean walking retcons?

[toushindai]

3 and 4 for the ask meme!

3) name five things that are NOT going to happen next

The Gerudo lieutenant Ganondorf just framed for something he did is not going to spill the beans on him

Ganondorf is not going to stay politely in his cell

Rauru is not going to be ready to face accusations of his own entitlement (I'm cheating with this answer. whether he's ready or not he's gonna have to anyway)

Zelda is not going to do. anything really. I'm sorry but this fic isn't about her. I'm having enough trouble even beginning to figure out why she (and possibly Mineru) haven't realized what's going on between Ganondorf and Rauru even though 100% of the servants have

Sonia's not going to set a date for Ganondorf's execution though tbqh at this particular moment in time she probably really wants to, given that Ganondorf is continuing to make her husband miserable

4) name five things that COULD happen next, logically

There are any number of ways Rauru could react to the Gerudo lieutenant telling him "actually I trust you even less than Ganondorf even though he just framed me and here's why;" I've not pinned down his exact reaction yet. He might honestly just. leave? Or he could make her arrest more stringent--an actual cell, instead of a heavily guarded so-can-I-sweet-talk-you-into-betraying-your-chief normal room.

Depending on what the fic needs, Rauru could go contemplate his daughter & the kind of legacy he's building for her, what kind of bridge he is being from his Zonai ancestors into the future he will someday leave to her.

Ganondorf could suggest that Rauru torture the lieutenant he scapegoated for information. Not sure that's an emotional beat I currently need but it's definitely one I considered earlier.

"All your servants know we're fucking" could become a relevant emotional beat. Strong possibility of this one, actually, I just have to figure out what it achieves (other than "makes Rauru feel bad about himself" because as much as that's presently one of Ganondorf's favorite things to do, it's also very well-trod ground at this point in time), and if I keep it I think I need to make an edit to chapter one to introduce it as a tension earlier. That's fine!!!!! Chapter one needs one billion edits. It's fine.

The Zonai folklore story I made up (the Hero of Dragons) could come up in the last antagonistic-philosophizing-before-sex scene or it could not. I don't know. I don't know. The problem with having made this up is that, with it established in my mind, it's something I can casually bring up when it's tangentially related, but for it to have any kind of resonance with a reader it actually needs to be full-on incorporated and I don't know how consistently I can do that. hh. the first draft has to EXIST it does not have to be GOOD yet. which is a relief because. it's not

[zeldadiscussions]

Word, I feel you and thank you too for taking the time to respond how you did.

I politely disagree about Rauru and Sonia. A character’s appearance and the coding of their culture are things the gamedevs have to choose, and I believe these specific choices were very deliberate. Combined with the Gerudo, the Shiekah (Japanese coded), Lurelin Hylians, and the Rito (who I’d also argue are poc coded, possibly northern Native American?), they help bring the number of poc heroes and cultures in the story up to more than half of the main cast. How is that not more inclusive?

With respect, I thought the point was made in the game that Zonai weren’t divine? That they only seemed that way to early Hylians because they were so technologically advanced?

The concept of a divine right to rule is 100% bad. No disagreement there. But… is that right ever actually stated to be one the royal family has, or are people just assuming that? Imho the whole goddess thing seems more like a retcon (I don’t think Hylia was even introduced until SS) to explain Zelda’s magic powers. The series isn’t actually about maintaining power for a certain family, it’s about protecting the people of the land from conquerors who do believe they have a right to subjugate others.

Again, with full respect, the belief that the unification of Hyrule was forceful has zero basis in the canon. That’s another assumption based on how real world history often went. There are no scenes of Rauru attacking other people for no reason. No scenes of him monologuing about his own superiority the way Ganondorf does. None of the other groups are resentful towards Hylians except the Yiga, specifically because of the actions of a specific corrupt Hyrule King who was not Rauru (which also goes to show that the royal family isn’t being depicted as completely infallible either.)

The zonaite masks are probably just armor and a uniform to show solidarity in-universe (like the Champion’s blue clothing pieces.) Mineru has one too, though it’s smaller. The ancient sages didn’t get much focus, probably so they wouldn’t outshine the current ones the way the Champions from BotW kinda did.

(What about Yunobo?? I haven’t seen that one.)

There were zonaite mines all over the Depths, not just the desert? Also they could get to those deposits underground… they wouldn’t need control of the surface above to sneak over and mine it (not cool but if they were evil they would do that? And, if that were the case, why build the line of Gerudo statues??) I’ve seen zero solid evidence of any of this, it all just seems like fabricating reasons to justify Ganondorf’s attacks, which simply is not necessary.

Okay so the secret stones… yes. I do trust the goat (dragon?) man to be responsible with that power, because he was. Ganondorf straight up mocks Rauru for not abusing their immense power the way he was about to as the Demon King. Rauru gave stones away to people he trusted to use them for good, so they could help him stop a tyrant. In the final true ending, the new sages still have their stones. They weren’t taken back by Link or anyone else.

With all of that in mind, I can’t really agree that the game has imperialistic themes even unintentionally. That view of things seems to be based not on the actual text but on how things tended to go in real world history. This is a fiction though, and in this fiction an idealistic land of diverse people is unified truly peacefully only to be assailed by a would-be conqueror. The good guys work together and help each other. There are leaders but they are leaders willingly followed by the people, people who are those leaders equals in dignity and bravery. The villain is a conqueror… an imperialist. That to me is as anti-imperialistic as it gets.

We can agree to disagree. If nothing else I’m glad people are on the lookout for that kind of thing, even if I don’t agree it’s a problem here.

I know I did not just see someone imply that bec Rauru is Zonai and bec Sonia is poc that Hyrule can't be imperialistic fhfhghh guys do we remember which country this game series is made in? Do we know the history of that country? Are the ppl of that country poc